Fiorinal and Fioricet Fiorinal vs. Fioricet?

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pharmacy

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Posted by

u/AMuslimPharmer

PharmD | Compounding | Owner Track 5 months ago

Fioricet vs fiorinal

Any idea why Fiorinal is considered a controlled substance while Fioricet is a legend drug?

The only difference is aspirin vs APAP, both have 50mg of butalbital.

Help me out here fellas, what am I missing?

10 comments

91% Upvoted
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level 1

SlickJoe

PharmD32 points · 5 months ago

South Carolina Code of Laws Section: 44-53-230 and Section 811(g) (3) (A) of the Controlled Substances Act].

Fioricet contains: 325 mg of acetaminophen (APAP), 50 mg of butalbital, and 40 mg of caffeine.

Fiorinal contains: 325 mg of aspirin (ASA), 50 mg of butalbital, and 40 mg of caffeine.

The only difference between these two is the aspirin in Fiorinal vs acetaminophen in Fioricet. The interesting thing is that Fiorinal is a scheduled class III substance, while Fioricet has a non-scheduled status. It seems really strange because both combinations contain equal amount of the controlled substance butalbital.

The exemption requires that one of the active ingredients be a non-narcotic controlled substance and one of the others be a non-scheduled compound. The potential for abuse is decreased if a sufficient amount of a non-controlled substance (e.g., aspirin or acetaminophen) is added.

The ratio required for exemption is 70 mg of acetaminophen to 15 mg of butalbital. In contrast, the ratio of aspirin to butalbital is 188 mg to 15 mg.

The acetaminophen to butalbital ratio is approximately 97 mg to 15 mg in Fioricet, thus it is exempt from scheduling. In Fiorinal the aspirin to butalbital ratio is approximately 97 mg to 15 mg, which is less than the 188mg:15mg ratio, so it is classified as a Schedule III substance.

level 2

AMuslimPharmer

PharmD | Compounding | Owner TrackOriginal Poster6 points · 5 months ago

You are a gentleman and a scholar.
Thanks for all the good info.
This is the indication I got from the sources I found online, but I couldn’t find anything as well-defined as this.

level 1

8RulesOfFightClub

4 points · 5 months ago

To decrease the risk of abuse, there needs to be a certain amount of non-controlled substance in order for the abuse potential to be deterred.

The ratios were set by the FDA (I don’t know how they did this). Based off what they decided for ratios, fiorinal doesn’t have enough aspirin to meet the criteria where the APAP ratio is enough.

level 1

zacharyrx

7 Pharmacy Calls1 point · 5 months ago · edited 5 months ago

They're both controlled on the state-level here in Florida.

Source: https://www.flsenate.gov/Laws/Statutes/2011/893.03

(3) SCHEDULE III.—A substance in Schedule III has a potential for abuse less than the substances contained in Schedules I and II and has a currently accepted medical use in treatment in the United States, and abuse of the substance may lead to moderate or low physical dependence or high psychological dependence or, in the case of anabolic steroids, may lead to physical damage. The following substances are controlled in Schedule III: (a) Unless specifically excepted or unless listed in another schedule, any material, compound, mixture, or preparation which contains any quantity of the following substances having a depressant or stimulant effect on the nervous system:

  1. Any substance which contains any quantity of a derivative of barbituric acid, including thiobarbituric acid, or any salt of a derivative of barbituric acid or thiobarbituric acid, including, but not limited to, butabarbital and butalbital.

level 1

27twss

PharmD | Retail RXM | KΨ1 point · 5 months ago

I always figured it’s because the abuse risk is lower with Fioricet because of the APAP. Similar to how hydrocodone/APAP used to be C3 but hydrocodone alone has always been C2.

level 1

t426g593

-1 points · 5 months ago

Short answer without going in-depth on the mechanism: aspirin in fiornal leads to higher serum concentrations of butalbital making it a CIII (at least in Kansas) hope that helps!

level 2

mehtabot

2 points · 5 months ago

From what I remember it has to do with the protein binding of aspirin leads to higher serum concentrations of butalbital in fiorinal vs fioricet.

level 2

AMuslimPharmer

PharmD | Compounding | Owner TrackOriginal Poster1 point · 5 months ago

Very interesting if true, any sources for this?

level 2

Trytofindmenowbitch

PharmD1 point · 5 months ago

That’s interesting. Have a reference?

level 1

Wizwillweebee

0 points · 5 months ago

They’re all controlled in Georgia

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r/pharmacy

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A subreddit for pharmacists, pharmacy students, techs, and anyone else in the pharmaceutical industry.

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r/pharmacy Rules
1.
No asking for medical advice
2.
No memes
3.
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Press J to jump to the feed. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts

log in sign up Visit Old Reddit
r/

pharmacy

Posts

8

Posted by

u/AMuslimPharmer

PharmD | Compounding | Owner Track 5 months ago

Fioricet vs fiorinal

Any idea why Fiorinal is considered a controlled substance while Fioricet is a legend drug?

The only difference is aspirin vs APAP, both have 50mg of butalbital.

Help me out here fellas, what am I missing?

10 comments

91% Upvoted
What are your thoughts? Log in or Sign up log in sign up
Sort by

level 1

SlickJoe

PharmD32 points · 5 months ago

South Carolina Code of Laws Section: 44-53-230 and Section 811(g) (3) (A) of the Controlled Substances Act].

Fioricet contains: 325 mg of acetaminophen (APAP), 50 mg of butalbital, and 40 mg of caffeine.

Fiorinal contains: 325 mg of aspirin (ASA), 50 mg of butalbital, and 40 mg of caffeine.

The only difference between these two is the aspirin in Fiorinal vs acetaminophen in Fioricet. The interesting thing is that Fiorinal is a scheduled class III substance, while Fioricet has a non-scheduled status. It seems really strange because both combinations contain equal amount of the controlled substance butalbital.

The exemption requires that one of the active ingredients be a non-narcotic controlled substance and one of the others be a non-scheduled compound. The potential for abuse is decreased if a sufficient amount of a non-controlled substance (e.g., aspirin or acetaminophen) is added.

The ratio required for exemption is 70 mg of acetaminophen to 15 mg of butalbital. In contrast, the ratio of aspirin to butalbital is 188 mg to 15 mg.

The acetaminophen to butalbital ratio is approximately 97 mg to 15 mg in Fioricet, thus it is exempt from scheduling. In Fiorinal the aspirin to butalbital ratio is approximately 97 mg to 15 mg, which is less than the 188mg:15mg ratio, so it is classified as a Schedule III substance.

level 2

AMuslimPharmer

PharmD | Compounding | Owner TrackOriginal Poster6 points · 5 months ago

You are a gentleman and a scholar.
Thanks for all the good info.
This is the indication I got from the sources I found online, but I couldn’t find anything as well-defined as this.

level 1

8RulesOfFightClub

4 points · 5 months ago

To decrease the risk of abuse, there needs to be a certain amount of non-controlled substance in order for the abuse potential to be deterred.

The ratios were set by the FDA (I don’t know how they did this). Based off what they decided for ratios, fiorinal doesn’t have enough aspirin to meet the criteria where the APAP ratio is enough.

level 1

zacharyrx

7 Pharmacy Calls1 point · 5 months ago · edited 5 months ago

They're both controlled on the state-level here in Florida.

Source: https://www.flsenate.gov/Laws/Statutes/2011/893.03

(3) SCHEDULE III.—A substance in Schedule III has a potential for abuse less than the substances contained in Schedules I and II and has a currently accepted medical use in treatment in the United States, and abuse of the substance may lead to moderate or low physical dependence or high psychological dependence or, in the case of anabolic steroids, may lead to physical damage. The following substances are controlled in Schedule III: (a) Unless specifically excepted or unless listed in another schedule, any material, compound, mixture, or preparation which contains any quantity of the following substances having a depressant or stimulant effect on the nervous system:

  1. Any substance which contains any quantity of a derivative of barbituric acid, including thiobarbituric acid, or any salt of a derivative of barbituric acid or thiobarbituric acid, including, but not limited to, butabarbital and butalbital.

level 1

27twss

PharmD | Retail RXM | KΨ1 point · 5 months ago

I always figured it’s because the abuse risk is lower with Fioricet because of the APAP. Similar to how hydrocodone/APAP used to be C3 but hydrocodone alone has always been C2.

level 1

t426g593

-1 points · 5 months ago

Short answer without going in-depth on the mechanism: aspirin in fiornal leads to higher serum concentrations of butalbital making it a CIII (at least in Kansas) hope that helps!

level 2

mehtabot

2 points · 5 months ago

From what I remember it has to do with the protein binding of aspirin leads to higher serum concentrations of butalbital in fiorinal vs fioricet.

level 2

AMuslimPharmer

PharmD | Compounding | Owner TrackOriginal Poster1 point · 5 months ago

Very interesting if true, any sources for this?

level 2

Trytofindmenowbitch

PharmD1 point · 5 months ago

That’s interesting. Have a reference?

level 1

Wizwillweebee

0 points · 5 months ago

They’re all controlled in Georgia

Community Details
r/pharmacy

37.6k

Subscribers

170

Online

A subreddit for pharmacists, pharmacy students, techs, and anyone else in the pharmaceutical industry.

Create Post
r/pharmacy Rules
1.
No asking for medical advice
2.
No memes
3.
All links must have a starter comment
4.
Posts regarding illicit drug use or acquisition
5.
Post pharmacy school related questions elsewhere
6.
Do not ask questions regarding your prescription
7.
Post career-related questions in the Career Thread
about careers press
advertise blog help
the reddit app reddit coins reddit premium reddit gifts
content policy | privacy policy
user agreement | mod policy
© 2018 Reddit, Inc. All rights reserved
Press J to jump to the feed. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts

log in sign up Visit Old Reddit
r/

pharmacy

Posts

8

Posted by

u/AMuslimPharmer

PharmD | Compounding | Owner Track 5 months ago

Fioricet vs fiorinal

Any idea why Fiorinal is considered a controlled substance while Fioricet is a legend drug?

The only difference is aspirin vs APAP, both have 50mg of butalbital.

Help me out here fellas, what am I missing?

10 comments

91% Upvoted
What are your thoughts? Log in or Sign up log in sign up
Sort by

level 1

SlickJoe

PharmD32 points · 5 months ago

South Carolina Code of Laws Section: 44-53-230 and Section 811(g) (3) (A) of the Controlled Substances Act].

Fioricet contains: 325 mg of acetaminophen (APAP), 50 mg of butalbital, and 40 mg of caffeine.

Fiorinal contains: 325 mg of aspirin (ASA), 50 mg of butalbital, and 40 mg of caffeine.

The only difference between these two is the aspirin in Fiorinal vs acetaminophen in Fioricet. The interesting thing is that Fiorinal is a scheduled class III substance, while Fioricet has a non-scheduled status. It seems really strange because both combinations contain equal amount of the controlled substance butalbital.

The exemption requires that one of the active ingredients be a non-narcotic controlled substance and one of the others be a non-scheduled compound. The potential for abuse is decreased if a sufficient amount of a non-controlled substance (e.g., aspirin or acetaminophen) is added.

The ratio required for exemption is 70 mg of acetaminophen to 15 mg of butalbital. In contrast, the ratio of aspirin to butalbital is 188 mg to 15 mg.

The acetaminophen to butalbital ratio is approximately 97 mg to 15 mg in Fioricet, thus it is exempt from scheduling. In Fiorinal the aspirin to butalbital ratio is approximately 97 mg to 15 mg, which is less than the 188mg:15mg ratio, so it is classified as a Schedule III substance.

level 2

AMuslimPharmer

PharmD | Compounding | Owner TrackOriginal Poster6 points · 5 months ago

You are a gentleman and a scholar.
Thanks for all the good info.
This is the indication I got from the sources I found online, but I couldn’t find anything as well-defined as this.

level 1

8RulesOfFightClub

4 points · 5 months ago

To decrease the risk of abuse, there needs to be a certain amount of non-controlled substance in order for the abuse potential to be deterred.

The ratios were set by the FDA (I don’t know how they did this). Based off what they decided for ratios, fiorinal doesn’t have enough aspirin to meet the criteria where the APAP ratio is enough.

level 1

zacharyrx

7 Pharmacy Calls1 point · 5 months ago · edited 5 months ago

They're both controlled on the state-level here in Florida.

Source: https://www.flsenate.gov/Laws/Statutes/2011/893.03

(3) SCHEDULE III.—A substance in Schedule III has a potential for abuse less than the substances contained in Schedules I and II and has a currently accepted medical use in treatment in the United States, and abuse of the substance may lead to moderate or low physical dependence or high psychological dependence or, in the case of anabolic steroids, may lead to physical damage. The following substances are controlled in Schedule III: (a) Unless specifically excepted or unless listed in another schedule, any material, compound, mixture, or preparation which contains any quantity of the following substances having a depressant or stimulant effect on the nervous system:

  1. Any substance which contains any quantity of a derivative of barbituric acid, including thiobarbituric acid, or any salt of a derivative of barbituric acid or thiobarbituric acid, including, but not limited to, butabarbital and butalbital.

level 1

27twss

PharmD | Retail RXM | KΨ1 point · 5 months ago

I always figured it’s because the abuse risk is lower with Fioricet because of the APAP. Similar to how hydrocodone/APAP used to be C3 but hydrocodone alone has always been C2.

level 1

t426g593

-1 points · 5 months ago

Short answer without going in-depth on the mechanism: aspirin in fiornal leads to higher serum concentrations of butalbital making it a CIII (at least in Kansas) hope that helps!

level 2

mehtabot

2 points · 5 months ago

From what I remember it has to do with the protein binding of aspirin leads to higher serum concentrations of butalbital in fiorinal vs fioricet.

level 2

AMuslimPharmer

PharmD | Compounding | Owner TrackOriginal Poster1 point · 5 months ago

Very interesting if true, any sources for this?

level 2

Trytofindmenowbitch

PharmD1 point · 5 months ago

That’s interesting. Have a reference?

level 1

Wizwillweebee

0 points · 5 months ago

They’re all controlled in Georgia

Community Details
r/pharmacy

37.6k

Subscribers

170

Online

A subreddit for pharmacists, pharmacy students, techs, and anyone else in the pharmaceutical industry.

Create Post
r/pharmacy Rules
1.
No asking for medical advice
2.
No memes
3.
All links must have a starter comment
4.
Posts regarding illicit drug use or acquisition
5.
Post pharmacy school related questions elsewhere
6.
Do not ask questions regarding your prescription
7.
Post career-related questions in the Career Thread
about careers press
advertise blog help
the reddit app reddit coins reddit premium reddit gifts
content policy | privacy policy
user agreement | mod policy
© 2018 Reddit, Inc. All rights reserved